Will The All Blacks Win the RWC?

[Tesrof]

Will the 'core of players' in the All Black team we saw play France win the RWC?  

OK there are likely to be a few changes, guys like Mehrtens, Maling, MacDonald & [I hope] Cullen could make a contribution, but do we have the right foundation for a Rugby World Cup winning team?

Sure we "could" win, but from what you've seen so far do you think we will?

'For mine' - of the three games we 'put away' a terrible Welsh team in a meaningless thrashing, but I've finished watching the other two feeling really disappointed.  I can't see that team (especially with the current dearth of leadership) being successful.

Cheers
T

[Captain Ordinary]

Tri Nations here we come ...  

[GO NSW]

Hey everybody im a first at Rugbyheads
Well my opinion on the WC and AB i would have to say that the All Blacks have a great chance but i believe the Wallabies can grab the cup just like last world cup the Wallabies played like crap against the blacks at eden park and they also had scrappy victories except the one against abs in Sydney but that was just Penalty after penalty.

The wallabies also had a few suspicous injuries like Jonny eales and Stephen larkham and then for the WC they were healthier than ever like look at the players now who are "injured"
Smith,Herbert,Burke,Larkham(again) and then this dropping of JP is a bit of a give away aswell as heenan like they will be in the WC squad 100% like Heenan is young and skilled the Abs did that in 95' with what players:
names like Kronfeld and Mehrts.
cheers

[Dingo]

Unfortunately the answer is looking more and more like no.

If No is the answer and NZ don't win will we once again look with hindsight at New Zealand rugby and question how a coach could have been appointed with no credentials to lead the AB's into a world cup.

A coach who's biggest success was being an assistant with an OK English team, (that has performed better since he left) and taking the Chiefs to 6th in the Super 12. The answer is unfortunately steering us all in the face, its just that we can't talk about it or question the very average game results that we have seen to date.

Remember in John's words "its all part of a journey".  Unfortunately the All Blacks has never been about being part of a journey, its all about winning and mana.

[Wobbly]

A coach who's biggest success was being an assistant with an OK English team, (that has performed better since he left) and taking the Chiefs to 6th in the Super 12.

I have to admit to similar concerns with Mitchell.  What I struggle with from him are:

Where is the pattern?  I can't work out who he thinks are the best players.  Or even if he has fielded the strongest 22 yet?  Was the team against England his choice?  Or bowing to the populist peoples choice?

What's the game plan??  Fast flashy backs and running the opposition off the park?  Beat England and France at their own games?  The players don't seem to have a Plan A, Plan B and Plan C when they go out there.

And finally:  His ridiculous media speak.  Shit, why can't he just come out and speak plain English like the rest of us.  The carefully chosen ponderous unanswers he gives are wearing thin.

Cheers,

Wobbly.

[Tesrof]

The players don't seem to have a Plan A, Plan B and Plan C when they go out there.

Or if there are different plans the players aren't capable of changing to them.  From what we've seen so far who are the leaders in the forward pack?

And finally:  His ridiculous media speak.  Shit, why can't he just come out and speak plain English like the rest of us.  The carefully chosen ponderous unanswers he gives are wearing thin.

People don't like listening to Murray Mexted, but at least he clearly says what he thinks.  Mitchell's like a Rob Nichol clone.

And to those who are preaching patience, remember the poor performances from the Crusaders?  Did their form improve enough to win?  The ulitmate winner was the team who showed (and maintained) top form from day one.  I fear we're watching history repeating itself.

Cheers
T

[Laney]

And to those who are preaching patience, remember the poor performances from the Crusaders?  Did their form improve enough to win?

If I recall correctly, when the Crusaders won in 1998, 1999, 2000 and in 2002 they had pretty slow and creaky starts to the season, but built up wonderfully for the business end.

Not to dispute your point- I'd clearly like to see us blitz everyone from day one. But even that most glorious of teams, the '02 Crusaders, had off days and close calls. At least if we're not playing 100% we're still winning- or one penalty kick away from winning against the top team in the world.

[Wobbly]

Or if there are different plans the players aren't capable of changing to them.  From what we've seen so far who are the leaders in the forward pack?

And same goes for the backs.  I have my doubts about Spencer's ability as a General in the backline...  Aside from his annoying wasting of space with lateral running he doesn't run a backline in the commanding fashion of Mehrts.

Wobbly.

[Tesrof]

Agreed.  And part of it is Umaga - those who touted him as an AB Captain have gone very quiet.  I was talking to a friend this morning about the lines Umaga runs before he gets Spencer's hospital passes.  He runs very close to Spencer just on his outside, effectively cutting off a wider miss pass and narrowing the point of attack.  This leaves Spencer with no real choice ....

Ten years ago we had forwards with good ball skills. Remember McDowell covering halfback and still getting a good pass away to Fox?  Jones & Zinzan were exceptional and they were backed up by other forwards - Whetton brothers, Mike Brewer, Shelford.  We seem to have lost that, so now when guys like Umaga are caught in the rucks/mauls, and we have forwards in the backline, there are fewer options for Spencer; kick possession away (a worse option with a poorly performing lineout), turn the ball back inside or try and set up something himself.

I would like to see Chris Jack given (or take) a greater leadership role in the forwards.  Leave McCaw to continue his distruction unemcumbered by leadership, but take the pressure off Reuben Thorne  so he can get his head down and do his job rather than drift about watching.

The lack of leadership could also show that Mitchell isn't empowering his players to make decisions themselves (eg Rodney So'oliao's quick tap against England - next week it'll be Rodney who?)  This is a sign of inexperienced leadership - too early for Mitchell to be All Black coach.

Cheers
T

And Wobbly, don't forget who's coaching the backs!

[Wobbly]

Oh I know who is coaching the backs...  This isn't and shouldn't be a Provincial argument.  I don't care who is coaching who and where they are from, so long as they do their job properly.

I agree with your Umaga comments.  He is having a very poor international season so far.  I guess maybe we have come to rely on him playing well without exception for a few years now, so this is a bit of a surprise.

On the coaching front, I would like to see the appearance of some planned moves.  They have been few and far between.  We have players who are great at swooping on broken play chances.  But they don't come often enough against well drilled opposition.  Space needs to be created.

My mind drifts back to some superb moves worked against the Boks in particular during past Tri Nations...  Mehrts on the wraparound, Umaga on the burst, Cullen flying out wide...  What has happened to those?

Cheers,

Wobbly.

[ugly ref]

TesRof

I think you'll find Umaga is running typical lines at centre, but by the time Spencer drifts 10 metres sideways poor Tana has nowhere to go, and no chance to burst through gaps. In fact half the time he is being held by a defender on the line of defence, well after when he should be receivng the ball.

Spencer has to learn how to cut out pass straight away. Maybe he is the maestro at Auckland and can run the show singlehandedly, but he is in a team with 5 match winners outside him now. It is time (and I'd suggest he gets 2 more games before Mehrts is ready/or comes in) to broaden his repetoire.

Undoubtedly he has the goods, but Mehrtens has proven in the past that he can distribute wide more intelligently than Carlos has shown us so far this international season. And Carlos has not proven that he can kick intelligently for territory on a consistent basis, something that a fit motivated Mehrts has as a forte.

Word from the Chch barflies is that Mehrts has dried himself out and is training hard.

ugly